Makima was not surprised, only nodding slightly and asking: "Please explain."
The other party was both a group member and the heir to a pure-blood devil family of the Seventy-Two Pillars of the Underworld in another world.
According to the description in the anime, even a pure-blood family below the Devil King possessed territory comparable to the size of a country, and their influence was immense.
Moreover, Rias's brother was Lucifer, the Devil King of the Underworld.
Although his performance in the original work was somewhat lacking, he also demonstrated his due talent after getting on the right track.
Compared to governing a country, Makima was clearly not as good as her.
"Miss Makima's ambition is indeed grand and noble, but perhaps you haven't considered what the world would become after you eliminate those devils who control various rules, as you call them?"
"Wouldn't it be a utopia where everyone lives in peace and contentment?"
"Utopia is merely a legendary term. After eliminating those rules, humans on earth will no longer have any desires or thoughts. Would that truly be considered a utopia? Even the God of the Bible cannot achieve such a thing."
"Even God can't do it? But I've read in books that God created the Garden of Eden, an ideal world without 07 suffering, sin, and death."
At this point, several people looked at Rosen almost simultaneously.
Makima even more so.
Rosen was also somewhat surprised.
Originally, he intended to let Makima realize the truth and understand it on her own, but he didn't expect Rias to step forward and directly state it.
Since that was the case, Rosen also shared his insights.
"The Garden of Eden is not a utopia. It was an ideal world created by God for people. People could live without labor because God provided everything they needed, but even so, utopia has always described the Garden of Eden, not the humans living within it."
"I know that Adam and Eve were tempted by the serpent to eat the forbidden fruit, and were eventually expelled from the Garden of Eden, symbolizing humanity's loss of innocence, and the acquisition of suffering and labor. But what I want to do is precisely to eliminate suffering in the human world. After humans lose those things, won't a utopia be built?"
"As for the needs you mentioned, I will also find a way to provide them."
"So what will you provide them with? Anyone can talk big!"
This was not said by Rosen, but by Gabriel.
She had already regarded Rosen as God in her heart, meaning her most loyal superior.
Now, seeing Makima, this devil, dare to contradict Rosen, she naturally felt a bit displeased.
As for utopia.
She had learned about this concept when she was in elementary school in Heaven.
Utopia does not exist, but the Garden of Eden does.
"I can have factories operate twenty-four hours a day to produce food and other human necessities."
"Then how will resources be extracted?"
"Machines can be used."
"Who will drive the machines?"
"Self-driving."
"Who will manufacture the machines?"
"Machines will manufacture them."
"?"
By the end, even Makima realized the flaw in her own question.
This was as unresolvable as the question of whether the chicken or the egg came first.
"I still reserve my opinion. As long as all concepts that can hinder or cause suffering are eliminated, a utopia will be built."
Upon hearing this.
Gabriel sighed.
"Do you think God can't do it?"
"God is omnipotent, so naturally, God can do it."
Makima nodded slightly.
The God of the Bible is omnipotent, creating the world in just seven days, so such suffering can naturally be eliminated.
"But if that were the case, humans would become devoid of desires and needs, no different from machines. They wouldn't have their own opinions or other thoughts. Even small things like resting, eating, and drinking wouldn't be done. For the entire society to operate, they would only be able to follow orders, but this would break the concept of a utopia."
Miss Gabriel sighed.
"This kind of thing can only be considered a pseudo-utopia."
"I didn't expect you, a Fallen Angel, to know so much?"
Frieren suddenly blurted out.
The expression on Miss Gabriel's face could no longer be held, and she wished she could retort immediately, but thinking that Rosen was here, she forcefully held back.
She could only secretly think in her heart about how to retort in the group chat later.
The other girls weren't surprised.
Frieren and Miss Gabriel often bickered, but in reality, their private relationship was good. Miss Gabriel often invited Frieren to her house to play games together.
"No matter what, I will try it myself."
Makima sighed.
When Rias finished speaking, she could only believe half of it, but when Rosen finished speaking, she believed ninety-nine percent.
As for the last one percent, it was purely her own persistence.
"So, Miss Makima, the reason you were assassinated was also because other countries didn't agree with your idea, right?"
Fubuki's attitude was also a bit radical.
After all, if Makima really had this plan, she would be using them as pawns.
If her older sister were present, perhaps seeing Makima so unrepentant, she would have long since just thrown up her hands and quit.
"Not only that, many of the assassins from other countries have a grudge against me."
Makima said.
"Many people have a grudge against me, but for several countries to send assassins, it must be more than just a simple personal vendetta."
Esdeath, who had been silent for a long time, spoke.
Hearing this, Makima fell silent.
She subtly glanced at Rosen and, finding that he had no intention of speaking, deeply sighed.
Her entire life had been spent calculating others, so it was normal for her to be hated.
But the real reason she was hated by almost everyone was her identity.
As Makima voluntarily revealed her identity, the group members who had only watched the first season of the anime showed expressions of extreme astonishment.
Rias, however, had some perception.
As a fellow Devil, she could sense Makima's difference.
Just like those evil monsters sealed in past wars.
Among everyone, only Rosen and Miss Gabriel's expressions remained as usual.
Seeing them all like this, Saeko Busujima asked curiously, "Lord Rosen and Miss Gabriel already knew?"
"It seems they deliberately kept it from us."
Frieren rubbed her belly after finishing the small cake. Although she still wanted to eat, her stomach was already full.
If only she could learn magic that would allow food to be digested quickly.